I. Background/Literary Context When examining a particular passage of scripture, there are many aspects that must be taken into consideration before delving into the text itself. Every passage should be examined through the various levels of context, beginning at the broadest (historical) level and ending with the narrow (immediate) context. Therefore, this portion of the paper will cover the historical context of the letter of Romans in an attempt to determine some preliminary information, such as Paul’s reason for writing the letter and the condition of the church to which he was writing. Although Paul does not explicitly state his reasons for writing to the Romans, there are a number of possibilities that are quite reasonable. First and foremost, Paul wrote to encourage and strengthen the church in Rome. In the introduction of the letter, Paul expresses his desire to “impart some spiritual gifts” to the believers there (1:8), and to preach to them (1:15). Because Paul couldn’t be there in person at the time, he chose in a sense to preach to them through his letter. Secondly, Paul used his letter to announce his plans to visit soon on his way to Spain (15:23-24). Although Paul had not previously been to Rome, it is likely that the Christians there had heard of him and would be excited to see him in person. Along those lines, Paul may have been using the letter as a personal introduction before he arrived in person. It is possible that Paul’s teachings were not well-known among all the Christians, so in order to establish credibility with the Roman believers who didn’t know him, Paul wrote them a compendium of teaching that outlined the core doctrines of Christianity. Another popular view of the book of Romans that is held today is the idea of the “weak” and the “strong”, which Paul addresses in 14:1-15:13. This was essentially a discussion of the contrasting convictions that the Jewish and Gentile Christians held, stemming from their differing backgrounds. Those who espouse this view hold that Paul’s intent was to mediate the differences and establish unity between the Jews and Gentiles (Morris, 12-13)Although scholars continue to debate the various reasons for the epistle, most agree that Paul likely wrote to the Roman church for a variety of reasons. Because there are few extra-biblical sources that shed light on the Roman church at the time of Paul’s letter, much of what is known today is based on the biblical accounts—specifically Acts and Romans. Most likely, Christianity made its way into Rome shortly after Pentecost when Roman merchants and travelers who heard Peter’s sermon returned to Rome and began meeting together (Acts 2:10). The church itself was composed of both Jewish believers and gentiles, some of whom Paul knew by name (Rom 16). Throughout the letter, Paul addressed both camps, clarifying some issues that the two groups apparently had disagreements about and seeking to establish unity, as stated earlier. In addition, Paul’s claim that he did not desire to “build upon the foundation of another” suggests that the Roman church lacked apostolic leadership, despite the traditional view that it was founded by Peter. This lack of a solid foundation is probably one of the most compelling reasons for the writing of the letter. Throughout the past two thousand years, the book of Romans has primarily been considered literature or propositional theology. Indeed, Romans is the closest New Testament book to a systematic theology, lacking only a few topics, such as eschatology and Christology. In late twentieth century, however, Wilhelm Wuellner and other scholars have introduced a new approach to Romans as argumentation, or rhetoric. The idea behind rhetoric is simple; it is the art of persuasion using language to convince or influence an audience. Although scholars disagree on the specific types of rhetoric used, it is clear even to the undereducated reader that Paul is writing the letter in order to educate his readers about the gospel and enact change in their lives. In fact, all scholars agree that the theme of Romans is the gospel (1:16-17). Everything that Paul writes about is in some way related to the good news that salvation is found in Christ Jesus. Because of Romans’ “systematic” style, it is easily divided into categories, with the first four chapters (1:18-4:25) outlining the universal reign of sin and justification by faith. In this section, Paul begins by establishing that all humans are accountable to God for sin (1:18-32). Chapter two deals with Jewish guilt and the limitations of the law, and chapters three and four deal with the actual doctrine of justification by faith, drawing parallels between the life of Abraham and Christians of today. Chapters five through eight constitute the next portion of the book, dealing with the assurance of the gospel and its benefits. Chapter five transitions from justification by faith to the hope of glory, with an excellent contrast of Adam and Christ, describing the hope and grace we have through Christ. As though Paul expects that some might take advantage of grace (5:20), he uses chapter six to deal with the supremacy of the gospel over the bondage of sin. He makes the point that not only are Christians freed from sin, but they are freed to righteousness (6:15-23). The following chapter is quite similar to six. Many consider it a parallel, dealing instead with Christians’ freedom from the law. In chapter eight, Paul again takes up the theme of assurance, this time introducing the Holy Spirit as the one who makes it possible for us to overcome sin and have a relationship with God. One key aspect of the beginning of the chapter is the contrast between walking in the flesh and walking in the Spirit. Walking in the flesh, which refers to living according to human lusts and desires, is repeatedly associated with death; while walking in the Spirit is shown to lead to peace and love (8:2, 5, 13). Overall, verses one through seventeen briefly summarize the ministry of the Holy Spirit in the lives of believers. Verses 18-27 give Christians a glimpse of the final glory that awaits, and the chapter concludes with the unfailing love of God that works through all things to bring the most good possible (Stott, 216-217). Chapters nine through sixteen will not be covered in this paper. Thus, Romans 8:12-17 fits nicely into not only the immediate context of chapter eight, but the context of chapters five through eight. Verses twelve through seventeen deal not only with the work of the Holy Spirit and importance of living in the Spirit, which is the theme of chapter eight, but also show the blessed assurance and hope that is available by living in the Spirit, in accordance with the general theme of chapters five through eight. Indeed, the passage goes right along with the very theme of the book itself—the gospel. The fact that believers are heirs of God together with Christ through the Spirit is essential to Christianity. It is a major aspect of the gospel itself. II. Interpretation and Exegesis Having established the contrast between life in the flesh and life in the Spirit in the first part of the chapter, he moves on in verse twelve, eager to shed light on implications of living in the Spirit. Therefore, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. Paul begins verse twelve with ouv or therefore, indicating that what follows will proceed from what he has previously established. But to what is Paul referring? The general interpretation is that Paul is referring to verses 1-11. This is likely the case. Because there is no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus (8:1), we are debtors. Wuest points out that Pauls use of the word “debtors”, or opheiletes, refers to a person “who is held in obligation, bound to some duty” (133). Again, because the righteous requirement of the law was fulfilled in us through God’s son (3, 4), we are indebted. Because the one who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to our mortal bodies (10), we are debtors. Indeed, believers are debtors, but Paul does not explicitly say to whom they are indebted (Morris, 311). Rather, Paul states what believers are not indebted to—to the flesh. Believers owe nothing to the fleshly, earthly desires that are common to man. They should have no bearing on our thoughts or actions. Paul’s explanation is quick to follow. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die. One must note that this is the fourth instance in which Paul forges the connection between the flesh and death in chapter eight (2, 3, 6, 13). He does not complete the contrast as he has in the other cases, however. Instead, Paul calls for the believer to put to death the deeds of the body through the Spirit. This, he says will bring life. This is significant for two reasons. The first reason is that if we are not killing the sin in our lives, sin will kill us. The apostle James knew what he was talking about when he wrote sin, when it is finished, brings forth death (1:15). This should be a wake up call for those Christians who allow sin to creep into their lives and look the other way. The second is that while believers are to rid themselves of sin, but they are not alone. It is not merely a hopeless command that we are to struggle with on our own. Instead, we are to put them to death by the Spirit, or with his help. An important parallel passage that reaffirms this idea is 1 Corinthians 10:13, which states that God provides a way of escape in every instance of temptation. There is no doubt that the Holy Spirit is involved in those “escapes”. What an incredible implication of having the Holy Spirit in one’s life! Paul continues in verse fourteen by stating that all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. This is the first of four instances in the next four verses in which Paul calls believers “sons” or “children”. Wuest makes the distinction that the word huios, or son, refers to a mature child of God in a legal standing, as against a child of God (teknon) (134). There is some speculation on the meaning of the word “led” as Paul uses it. Several well-known theologians hold that the Spirit not only leads the believer in the sense that he is actively driven by the Spirit (Stott, 231). It seems unlikely that this is the case however, because the emphasis of the previous verse seems to be on the individual believer acting out against his sin, with the help of the Spirit. Either way, both sides agree that being led by the Spirit is more of a “distinguishing mark”, as opposed to the catalyst that makes us His sons (Morris, 313). In verse fifteen, Paul continues to elaborate on sonship to God, declaring, for you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear… Stott points out that Paul is trying to establish two points about the Spirit: “first negatively, that the Spirit believers received is not one of bondage; and second, positively, that he is a Spirit of sonship” (314). Another possibility is that Paul used the phrase Spirit of slavery as a clarification of verse twelve, where Paul stated that we are in debt because of the work of the Spirit. Although we are in “obligation”, as the NIV states, we are not literally enslaved by the Spirit to Christ. Additionally, with the use of the word again, Paul refers to the state from which the believer was rescued. No, instead of slavery to fear, believers have received the Spirit of adoption, or sonship. One must note that the idea of adoption was not an idea that was native to Jewish custom. Instead, it was a Greco-Roman concept that Paul incorporated into his writings. The purpose of this type of adoption was often to carry on the name of a family, for lack of another male child. In these cases, the adopted son would have been loved just as much, if not more, than a family’s own son, because of what his adoption accomplished for his parents (Arnold, 47). It is for this reason that Paul says believers cry Abba, Father. The word Abba is Aramaic for father, and is quite personal, indicating the nature of the believer’s relationship with the Father through the Spirit. The next verse describes the feeling that we have as sons of God. Not only does the believer’s own spirit testify that he is a son of God, but the Holy Spirit testifies as well. This is another work that the Spirit performs on our behalf. Moo points out that “the Holy Spirit is not only instrumental in making us God’s children; he also makes us aware that we are God’s children” (504). Although as humans we may sometimes doubt our sonship for various reasons, we have no reason to doubt the testimony that the Holy Spirit bears on our behalf. The final verse of the passage acts as a transition, moving from the “incomplete” benefits that believers presently have to the full benefits of that adoption that will be revealed in the future. This is not the sole purpose of the verse, however. Paul begins the word with kai, continuing the idea that he began in verse sixteen: And if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ… Certainly Paul has been saving the best benefits of the Spirit for last. Continuing the idea that we are adopted as God’s sons, he makes it clear that we also his heirs, making it clear that as his children, he nothing will be held back from us. The use of the word heirs, however, suggests that while our status is presently his children, there are benefits that we have yet to receive. Indeed, in Greco-Roman culture, although the adopted son was legally the son in every capacity, often the complete benefits of the adoption did not take effect until much later (Moo, 504). In fact, Paul goes so far as to say that believers are heirs along with Christ. This is in line with Moo’s view of adoption, because in effect, Christ is still awaiting his benefits as heir to God. Currently, he waits at the right hand of the Father until he is glorified above all and his enemies are made his footstool. Paul includes a qualification for this final glorification on our part, however. Indeed, just as Christ had to suffer to “earn” his glory (Luke 24:26), so must we share in his sufferings in order to share in his glory. This concept of suffering for Christ, however, is quite foreign to many of today’s Christians, particularly in the United States and other “free” countries. When Paul wrote eiper sumpaschomen, “provided that we suffer with Him”, he no doubt was referring to the many trials and tribulations that he had endured as a Christian. These of course, included shipwrecks, beatings, hunger, exposure, etc. At any given time, it is likely that there were people who were seeking to kill Paul. At the time of the writing of the letter, tensions were were already high between the Jews and Christians and the Romans (Edersheim, 66-67). And of course, the persecution would escalate exponentially under Nero’s reign. First world Christians of today, however, only think of persecution as being made fun of or being called dirty names. In fact, it is quite a common occurrence to hear students at Moody complain about the “trials and tribulations” of having several homework assignments due. This is quite simply not what biblical authors were referring to when they talked about suffering hardships for Christ. These were men who were in danger of death—not men who complained about writing a five-page paper at Bible school. Only in the most general interpretation could the suffering that Paul mentions refer to writing papers, doing chores around the house, or any other
No, dear friends, I am still not all I should be, but I am focusing my energies on this one thing: Forgetting the past and looking forward to what lies ahead... Philippians 3:13
When you are old and gray and full of sleep, and nodding by the fire, take down this book and slowly read, and dream of the soft look your eyes had once, and of their shadows deep. Willam Butler Yeats
6 comments:
Are you certified in CPR?????
Rach, I'm not sure - maybe I'm only CPR certified on "Hannah/Mike" (what Martha and I named our dummy)....
I. Background/Literary Context
When examining a particular passage of scripture, there are many aspects that must be taken into consideration before delving into the text itself. Every passage should be examined through the various levels of context, beginning at the broadest (historical) level and ending with the narrow (immediate) context. Therefore, this portion of the paper will cover the historical context of the letter of Romans in an attempt to determine some preliminary information, such as Paul’s reason for writing the letter and the condition of the church to which he was writing.
Although Paul does not explicitly state his reasons for writing to the Romans, there are a number of possibilities that are quite reasonable. First and foremost, Paul wrote to encourage and strengthen the church in Rome. In the introduction of the letter, Paul expresses his desire to “impart some spiritual gifts” to the believers there (1:8), and to preach to them (1:15). Because Paul couldn’t be there in person at the time, he chose in a sense to preach to them through his letter. Secondly, Paul used his letter to announce his plans to visit soon on his way to Spain (15:23-24). Although Paul had not previously been to Rome, it is likely that the Christians there had heard of him and would be excited to see him in person. Along those lines, Paul may have been using the letter as a personal introduction before he arrived in person. It is possible that Paul’s teachings were not well-known among all the Christians, so in order to establish credibility with the Roman believers who didn’t know him, Paul wrote them a compendium of teaching that outlined the core doctrines of Christianity. Another popular view of the book of Romans that is held today is the idea of the “weak” and the “strong”, which Paul addresses in 14:1-15:13. This was essentially a discussion of the contrasting convictions that the Jewish and Gentile Christians held, stemming from their differing backgrounds. Those who espouse this view hold that Paul’s intent was to mediate the differences and establish unity between the Jews and Gentiles (Morris, 12-13)Although scholars continue to debate the various reasons for the epistle, most agree that Paul likely wrote to the Roman church for a variety of reasons.
Because there are few extra-biblical sources that shed light on the Roman church at the time of Paul’s letter, much of what is known today is based on the biblical accounts—specifically Acts and Romans. Most likely, Christianity made its way into Rome shortly after Pentecost when Roman merchants and travelers who heard Peter’s sermon returned to Rome and began meeting together (Acts 2:10). The church itself was composed of both Jewish believers and gentiles, some of whom Paul knew by name (Rom 16). Throughout the letter, Paul addressed both camps, clarifying some issues that the two groups apparently had disagreements about and seeking to establish unity, as stated earlier. In addition, Paul’s claim that he did not desire to “build upon the foundation of another” suggests that the Roman church lacked apostolic leadership, despite the traditional view that it was founded by Peter. This lack of a solid foundation is probably one of the most compelling reasons for the writing of the letter.
Throughout the past two thousand years, the book of Romans has primarily been considered literature or propositional theology. Indeed, Romans is the closest New Testament book to a systematic theology, lacking only a few topics, such as eschatology and Christology. In late twentieth century, however, Wilhelm Wuellner and other scholars have introduced a new approach to Romans as argumentation, or rhetoric. The idea behind rhetoric is simple; it is the art of persuasion using language to convince or influence an audience. Although scholars disagree on the specific types of rhetoric used, it is clear even to the undereducated reader that Paul is writing the letter in order to educate his readers about the gospel and enact change in their lives. In fact, all scholars agree that the theme of Romans is the gospel (1:16-17). Everything that Paul writes about is in some way related to the good news that salvation is found in Christ Jesus. Because of Romans’ “systematic” style, it is easily divided into categories, with the first four chapters (1:18-4:25) outlining the universal reign of sin and justification by faith. In this section, Paul begins by establishing that all humans are accountable to God for sin (1:18-32). Chapter two deals with Jewish guilt and the limitations of the law, and chapters three and four deal with the actual doctrine of justification by faith, drawing parallels between the life of Abraham and Christians of today. Chapters five through eight constitute the next portion of the book, dealing with the assurance of the gospel and its benefits. Chapter five transitions from justification by faith to the hope of glory, with an excellent contrast of Adam and Christ, describing the hope and grace we have through Christ. As though Paul expects that some might take advantage of grace (5:20), he uses chapter six to deal with the supremacy of the gospel over the bondage of sin. He makes the point that not only are Christians freed from sin, but they are freed to righteousness (6:15-23). The following chapter is quite similar to six. Many consider it a parallel, dealing instead with Christians’ freedom from the law. In chapter eight, Paul again takes up the theme of assurance, this time introducing the Holy Spirit as the one who makes it possible for us to overcome sin and have a relationship with God. One key aspect of the beginning of the chapter is the contrast between walking in the flesh and walking in the Spirit. Walking in the flesh, which refers to living according to human lusts and desires, is repeatedly associated with death; while walking in the Spirit is shown to lead to peace and love (8:2, 5, 13). Overall, verses one through seventeen briefly summarize the ministry of the Holy Spirit in the lives of believers. Verses 18-27 give Christians a glimpse of the final glory that awaits, and the chapter concludes with the unfailing love of God that works through all things to bring the most good possible (Stott, 216-217). Chapters nine through sixteen will not be covered in this paper.
Thus, Romans 8:12-17 fits nicely into not only the immediate context of chapter eight, but the context of chapters five through eight. Verses twelve through seventeen deal not only with the work of the Holy Spirit and importance of living in the Spirit, which is the theme of chapter eight, but also show the blessed assurance and hope that is available by living in the Spirit, in accordance with the general theme of chapters five through eight. Indeed, the passage goes right along with the very theme of the book itself—the gospel. The fact that believers are heirs of God together with Christ through the Spirit is essential to Christianity. It is a major aspect of the gospel itself.
II. Interpretation and Exegesis
Having established the contrast between life in the flesh and life in the Spirit in the first part of the chapter, he moves on in verse twelve, eager to shed light on implications of living in the Spirit. Therefore, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. Paul begins verse twelve with ouv or therefore, indicating that what follows will proceed from what he has previously established. But to what is Paul referring? The general interpretation is that Paul is referring to verses 1-11. This is likely the case. Because there is no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus (8:1), we are debtors. Wuest points out that Pauls use of the word “debtors”, or opheiletes, refers to a person “who is held in obligation, bound to some duty” (133). Again, because the righteous requirement of the law was fulfilled in us through God’s son (3, 4), we are indebted. Because the one who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to our mortal bodies (10), we are debtors. Indeed, believers are debtors, but Paul does not explicitly say to whom they are indebted (Morris, 311). Rather, Paul states what believers are not indebted to—to the flesh. Believers owe nothing to the fleshly, earthly desires that are common to man. They should have no bearing on our thoughts or actions. Paul’s explanation is quick to follow. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die. One must note that this is the fourth instance in which Paul forges the connection between the flesh and death in chapter eight (2, 3, 6, 13). He does not complete the contrast as he has in the other cases, however. Instead, Paul calls for the believer to put to death the deeds of the body through the Spirit. This, he says will bring life. This is significant for two reasons. The first reason is that if we are not killing the sin in our lives, sin will kill us. The apostle James knew what he was talking about when he wrote sin, when it is finished, brings forth death (1:15). This should be a wake up call for those Christians who allow sin to creep into their lives and look the other way. The second is that while believers are to rid themselves of sin, but they are not alone. It is not merely a hopeless command that we are to struggle with on our own. Instead, we are to put them to death by the Spirit, or with his help. An important parallel passage that reaffirms this idea is 1 Corinthians 10:13, which states that God provides a way of escape in every instance of temptation. There is no doubt that the Holy Spirit is involved in those “escapes”. What an incredible implication of having the Holy Spirit in one’s life!
Paul continues in verse fourteen by stating that all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. This is the first of four instances in the next four verses in which Paul calls believers “sons” or “children”. Wuest makes the distinction that the word huios, or son, refers to a mature child of God in a legal standing, as against a child of God (teknon) (134). There is some speculation on the meaning of the word “led” as Paul uses it. Several well-known theologians hold that the Spirit not only leads the believer in the sense that he is actively driven by the Spirit (Stott, 231). It seems unlikely that this is the case however, because the emphasis of the previous verse seems to be on the individual believer acting out against his sin, with the help of the Spirit. Either way, both sides agree that being led by the Spirit is more of a “distinguishing mark”, as opposed to the catalyst that makes us His sons (Morris, 313).
In verse fifteen, Paul continues to elaborate on sonship to God, declaring, for you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear… Stott points out that Paul is trying to establish two points about the Spirit: “first negatively, that the Spirit believers received is not one of bondage; and second, positively, that he is a Spirit of sonship” (314). Another possibility is that Paul used the phrase Spirit of slavery as a clarification of verse twelve, where Paul stated that we are in debt because of the work of the Spirit. Although we are in “obligation”, as the NIV states, we are not literally enslaved by the Spirit to Christ. Additionally, with the use of the word again, Paul refers to the state from which the believer was rescued. No, instead of slavery to fear, believers have received the Spirit of adoption, or sonship. One must note that the idea of adoption was not an idea that was native to Jewish custom. Instead, it was a Greco-Roman concept that Paul incorporated into his writings. The purpose of this type of adoption was often to carry on the name of a family, for lack of another male child. In these cases, the adopted son would have been loved just as much, if not more, than a family’s own son, because of what his adoption accomplished for his parents (Arnold, 47). It is for this reason that Paul says believers cry Abba, Father. The word Abba is Aramaic for father, and is quite personal, indicating the nature of the believer’s relationship with the Father through the Spirit.
The next verse describes the feeling that we have as sons of God. Not only does the believer’s own spirit testify that he is a son of God, but the Holy Spirit testifies as well. This is another work that the Spirit performs on our behalf. Moo points out that “the Holy Spirit is not only instrumental in making us God’s children; he also makes us aware that we are God’s children” (504). Although as humans we may sometimes doubt our sonship for various reasons, we have no reason to doubt the testimony that the Holy Spirit bears on our behalf.
The final verse of the passage acts as a transition, moving from the “incomplete” benefits that believers presently have to the full benefits of that adoption that will be revealed in the future. This is not the sole purpose of the verse, however. Paul begins the word with kai, continuing the idea that he began in verse sixteen: And if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ… Certainly Paul has been saving the best benefits of the Spirit for last. Continuing the idea that we are adopted as God’s sons, he makes it clear that we also his heirs, making it clear that as his children, he nothing will be held back from us. The use of the word heirs, however, suggests that while our status is presently his children, there are benefits that we have yet to receive. Indeed, in Greco-Roman culture, although the adopted son was legally the son in every capacity, often the complete benefits of the adoption did not take effect until much later (Moo, 504). In fact, Paul goes so far as to say that believers are heirs along with Christ. This is in line with Moo’s view of adoption, because in effect, Christ is still awaiting his benefits as heir to God. Currently, he waits at the right hand of the Father until he is glorified above all and his enemies are made his footstool. Paul includes a qualification for this final glorification on our part, however. Indeed, just as Christ had to suffer to “earn” his glory (Luke 24:26), so must we share in his sufferings in order to share in his glory. This concept of suffering for Christ, however, is quite foreign to many of today’s Christians, particularly in the United States and other “free” countries. When Paul wrote eiper sumpaschomen, “provided that we suffer with Him”, he no doubt was referring to the many trials and tribulations that he had endured as a Christian. These of course, included shipwrecks, beatings, hunger, exposure, etc. At any given time, it is likely that there were people who were seeking to kill Paul. At the time of the writing of the letter, tensions were were already high between the Jews and Christians and the Romans (Edersheim, 66-67). And of course, the persecution would escalate exponentially under Nero’s reign. First world Christians of today, however, only think of persecution as being made fun of or being called dirty names. In fact, it is quite a common occurrence to hear students at Moody complain about the “trials and tribulations” of having several homework assignments due. This is quite simply not what biblical authors were referring to when they talked about suffering hardships for Christ. These were men who were in danger of death—not men who complained about writing a five-page paper at Bible school. Only in the most general interpretation could the suffering that Paul mentions refer to writing papers, doing chores around the house, or any other
Joy I don't know as many words as "non-exegetical wonderboy." However, I am certified in first aid....can I help you?
To my dearest Joy,
YOU ARE DONE WITH FINALS FOREVER!! WELL MAYBE NOT FOREVER BUT FOR 3 MONTHS.STOP BEING SO SLACK AND GET A NEW BLOG UP:)
Love,
everyone's favorite cat
yeah joy...LAME! i have more great stories for you! so you better call soon before more great stories overtake the already amazing ones...
hint--call late
=)
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